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Use IB managed OCO and bracket orders is ticked, but only the entry order shows up in TWS

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[2013-10-14 09:24:17] #1 [Go To First Post]
User59879 - Posts: 66
If I define a bracket order in IB, eg. buy-limit, plus an oco target+stop, then all 3 orders show up in IB. If I define the same bracket order in Sierra, then only the entry order shows up, which leads me to believe that the target+stop orders have not been transmitted, and are not server managed. Use IB managed OCO and bracket orders is ticked in the IB settings window in Sierra. How can I submit server-managed target+stop orders with my entry order?

[2013-10-14 09:38:03] #2 [Go To First Post]
Sierra Chart Engineering - Posts: 104368
You can find complete details about this here: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=doc/doc_AttachedOrders.html Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, change to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing

[2013-10-14 09:47:21] #3 [Go To First Post]
User59879 - Posts: 66
Thank you for your quick answer. I have studied that page, and all seems to be working well: orders get properly attached to my entry order in Sierra, and both entry order and attached orders are visible on the chart from the moment that I submit the order. However in TWS only the entry order shows up, and the attached orders are missing, in spite of "Use IB managed OCO and bracket orders" being ticked in the Global Settings -> Data/Trade Service Settings -> IB -> More IB Settings window. Am I missing something?

[2013-10-14 09:54:15] #4 [Go To First Post]
Sierra Chart Engineering - Posts: 104368
When a parent order is filled, the Attached Orders will become active and are sent to the connected Trading service or are then processed by the Sierra Chart Trade Simulation system. Until the parent fills, the Attached Orders will be inactive and held within Sierra Chart. They will not be sent to the connected Trading service until there is a fill or partial fill of the parent order. Until the child orders become active and are sent, they will be listed as having a Quantity of 0. Also, in newer versions, the name of the Interactive Brokers option for IB Managed OCO orders has been renamed to be more clear for exactly what it is for. Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, change to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing Date Time Of Last Edit: 2013-10-14 09:56:13

[2013-10-14 10:27:39] #5 [Go To First Post]
User59879 - Posts: 66
Hm, that is exactly what I'd like to avoid .... if I loose the link with my broker while the entry order is pending and getting filled, I may end up with a position without stop-loss :-( If I create the same entry order + attached orders in TWS, then IB manages all of them at the server, so if I loose my link then at least I have a managed stop. Are you sure that Sierra cannot support this feature via TWS?

[2013-10-14 11:02:59] #6 [Go To First Post]
rc7rader - Posts: 144
Hm, that is exactly what I'd like to avoid .... if I loose the link with my broker while the entry order is pending and getting filled, I may end up with a position without stop-loss :-( If I create the same entry order + attached orders in TWS, then IB manages all of them at the server, so if I loose my link then at least I have a managed stop. Are you sure that Sierra cannot support this feature via TWS? This is a very important issue. With Sierrachart holding the attached order until the parent order gets filled, SierraChart is exposing traders to great risk in case connection to IB is lost and the parent order gets filled. I hope SierraChart will address this important issue.

[2013-10-14 13:02:33] #7 [Go To First Post]
User59879 - Posts: 66
Provided that there is no way to have the attached orders managed at the IB server right from the start, it would be a show-stopper for those exact reasons. But there must be a way to get this to work?

[2013-10-15 10:16:15] #8 [Go To First Post]
User59879 - Posts: 66
Dear Sierra staff, can you please confirm or deny that there is no way (anymore?) to have Sierra pass attached orders to TWS together with the entry, so that bracket orders can be managed at the IB server? If the attached orders of a bracket order are only sent from Sierra once the entry has been filled, then this poses a serious risk for traders in case of loss of the internet link, as one might end up with a position without a stop-loss in the market. Please confirm that I have understood this correctly, or tell me how I can configure bracket orders to be handled at the IB server. Thank you very much for your reply in advance. Date Time Of Last Edit: 2013-10-15 10:17:00

[2013-10-16 03:13:46] #9 [Go To First Post]
Sierra Chart Engineering - Posts: 104368
There is no way from Sierra Chart currently to submit a bracket order to TWS. You have understood this correctly. We have considered supporting Interactive Brokers bracket orders, but have not because it only increases the complexity of trade order management in Sierra Chart. And it only exposes Sierra Chart further to more problems if Interactive Brokers does not handle the orders properly. In the past when we used Interactive Brokers bracket orders, we can remember how sometimes they would not work right when submitted. So for these reasons, this creates a strong hesitation to support this. Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, change to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing Date Time Of Last Edit: 2013-10-23 18:16:43

[2013-10-16 17:55:01] #10 [Go To First Post]
User59879 - Posts: 66
Thank you for your answer. I understand and appreciate your considerations. Unfortunately, in my opinion lack of support for IB server-managed bracket orders renders this beautiful attached-order feature quite useless, because it exposes traders to the risk of opening a position in the market and then not being able to submit vital attached stop-orders, due to loss of internet link. I seriously hope that you will consider to implement support for managed bracket orders at the server again. Thank you for you considerations, Jan Humme.

[2013-10-16 18:41:25] #11 [Go To First Post]
Ufo de Jager - Posts: 16
At the moment I am using the sim mode only, for training purpose. But I have had one occurrence that I lost contact with the IB server (the only time in 5 years) when I was in the middle of a trade with live DAX futures. I would have been broke if there wasn't a SL / bracket. Entering the market without a SL is potential financial suicide. So the way it is right now, is useless..... So hopefully there will be a work around in the near future.

[2013-10-17 04:27:00] #12 [Go To First Post]
rc7rader - Posts: 144
Since attaching IB bracket orders created complexities of trade management in SierraChart, maybe SierraChart engineers could look into at least putting in an attached STOP LOSS order with the parent order if this is doable. This would be a good alternative than not having a stop placed in the IB server with the parent order. The user/trader can separately put the target order afterwards when the parent order is filled and IB connection is not lost. I believe stop loss order is the most important order once the parent order has been filled to protect against substantial loss. I hope SierraChart can comment on this if this is doable or not. Thank you. Date Time Of Last Edit: 2013-10-17 04:28:29

[2013-10-19 19:09:09] #13 [Go To First Post]
Sierra Chart Engineering - Posts: 104368
We see how important this is, therefore we will work on adding the capability for Interactive Brokers bracket order support. We do not want to promise when it will be done but we will do our best. Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, change to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing

[2013-10-19 20:41:36] #14 [Go To First Post]
User59879 - Posts: 66
Very much appreciated, I love the way you guys pick up on important issues! If I can provide any assistance to help testing this feature once you got something ready, please let me know, I will be glad to help out. Best regards, Jan Humme.

[2013-10-20 20:05:15] #15 [Go To First Post]
phaedonk - Posts: 350
Another thumbs up from me! This is a very critical feature to have and a constant headache for me to not have the peace of mind that my stop is at the server from the moment I submit my orders.

[2013-10-28 21:41:08] #16 [Go To First Post]
User12463 - Posts: 1
Thank you for the posts regarding this issue. I too have just started the demo of Sierra in order to handle and then edit more complex OCO/scaling orders. Since I am still trying to resolve data issues, and have not even gotten to these issues regarding having an initial stop at the open of a trade, it was important to have this pointed out. This really is a critically important issue to have a stop loss at the very least when opening a trade. I have not had a chance to send support questions on certain problems that I have had... but I have watched Sierra not update charts in real time, even when my other software is functioning fine and my internet connection seems OK. So it is not just an issue of internet connectivity, but also the comfort in knowing that at least the basic bracketed order is in at the open of a trade. I would not even think of trading without this...as it is a disaster waiting to happen. My intention was to have bracketed orders in with adjustable( presets ) stops....without being at the computer...and not knowing if or when the market would hit my trade entry. With the limitation of not being able to bracket an order...held on the server for a filled entry order.....I would never be able to use this. I hope this issue can be resolved. Thanks.

[2013-10-28 23:07:08] #17 [Go To First Post]
Sierra Chart Engineering - Posts: 104368
For help with an Intraday chart not updating in real-time, refer to this help topic: http://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=doc/helpdetails3.html Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, change to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing

[2013-11-18 15:11:10] #18 [Go To First Post]
User59879 - Posts: 66
I have noticed that FXCM also does not allow usage of bracket orders unfortunately. Will this added capability for Interactive Brokers also work for FXCM?

[2013-11-19 01:20:56] #19 [Go To First Post]
Sierra Chart Engineering - Posts: 104368
No. The way that bracket orders are implemented on the Trading service side, sometimes is in a way which is so incompatible that it is just not possible to support them at all. Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, change to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing Date Time Of Last Edit: 2013-11-19 01:21:32

[2013-11-19 07:20:49] #20 [Go To First Post]
User59879 - Posts: 66
Would you consider to support on FXCM as well?

[2013-11-19 07:52:06] #21 [Go To First Post]
Sierra Chart Engineering - Posts: 104368
No. We cannot do that. We will only be supporting the server side bracket orders with Interactive Brokers. Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, change to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing

[2013-11-19 07:57:57] #22 [Go To First Post]
User59879 - Posts: 66
But I believe that FXCM uses the FIX API. Doesn't FIX support bracket orders? Not being able to submit a bracket order when opening a new position poses a serious risk, as one can end up with a position without a stop loss order.

[2013-11-19 18:40:37] #23 [Go To First Post]
Sierra Chart Engineering - Posts: 104368
FXCM FIX may support bracket orders but not in a way in which is compatible with or would work reliably with Sierra Chart. Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, change to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing

[2013-11-28 06:17:24] #24 [Go To First Post]
tobi - Posts: 351
We see how important this is, therefore we will work on adding the capability for Interactive Brokers bracket order support. We do not want to promise when it will be done but we will do our best. Had a (rare) power outage yesterday while having a limit order sitting in the market. Nothing happend as the power was pretty much right back, but this brought the IB/SC bracket order issue back to my mind. Any news on that or a rough schedule when this could be working? Thank you for considering adding this. Date Time Of Last Edit: 2013-11-28 06:31:38

[2013-11-28 07:04:14] #25 [Go To First Post]
Kiwi - Posts: 374
Thanks also from me for looking at adding it back again. The lack of this capability has forced me to manage all of my longer term orders on TWS directly so it would be fantastic to have it back. Brilliant. Really brilliant.

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