Support Board
Date/Time: Wed, 10 Sep 2025 07:50:34 +0000
SC Quits when Paste Large Formula into Spreadsheet Window
View Count: 2500
| [2016-04-06 14:02:16] |
| User791263 - Posts: 151 |
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UPDATED (this section posted in new post below) I though might be Possible INFINTE or Undeterminate Value in Formula. It is not. It's something strange. Perhaps a circular reference, such as K3 referring to NOT L3 true, and vise versa. Just adding one term: L3=0 caused K then shut down the SC instance w/ no warning. I did several tests, pasting a little at a time. Nor has the problem anything to do with size-characters limit (althought these are big 2200 ch. forumlas). I'm going to Post this part as a new post in this thread, so the disregard can be negated. Will provide additional details as available. - - - - BELOW is Original post This behaved same under 1382 as 1392. I've seen this consistently now, when my K column formula gets up to about 2160 (est) characters, pasted into New Spreadsheets >> view window, when I hit "OK", that window closes, then .5 second later, my whole instance vanishes- gone. I keep that window inside the spreadsheet view. That spreadsheet is not detached. I only use NOTEPAD to avoid special characters, and it does not do this on smaller formulas. This has only grown this big lately, so I think that may be the cause. I do have line feeds at each condition, about 36 lines. I can't use other columns to split the formula-- they're all used up as components of K, M, etc. I shut down, reboot, even, but still same behavior. Have I hit a formula characters limit? Any ideas? Obviously I can't refine and develop on that while trading. Date Time Of Last Edit: 2016-04-06 17:16:22
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| [2016-04-06 16:47:09] |
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We need to fix this problem. Can you provide us the text of what you are pasting. Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, *change* to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing |
| [2016-04-06 17:18:00] |
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It is essential that we get the actual text of the formula that you are working with , to be able to resolve this.
Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, *change* to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing Date Time Of Last Edit: 2016-04-06 18:21:45
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| [2016-04-06 17:44:11] |
| Jeffrey - Posts: 2287 |
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If the issue is happening on a spreadsheet used by the Spreadsheet study, and you can repeat the issue, try closing the chartbook and opening the spreadsheet itself, and see if you can still repeat the issue. If you can repeat the issue with just the spreadsheet, we will need the spreadsheet file and the steps to repeat the issue. Otherwise we will need the chartbook in addition to the spreadsheet file and the steps to repeat the issue. |
| [2016-04-06 17:54:29] |
| User791263 - Posts: 151 |
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UPDATED (this was added to top of prior Post- where I erroneously had"disregard") I know you can't get bogged down in complex trading systems,so maybe just ask around if anyone has seen this behavior, and suggest tests or direction to debug. I though it might be an INFINTE/Indeterminate Value. It is not. It's strange. I'll need more incremental tests' results (added small terms) to advise. Perhaps a circular reference, such as K3 referring to NOT L3 true, and vise versa. When I just added: L3=0 caused K to shut down SC. I did a few tests, little at a time, only a couple of small terms cause it. - - - - - - - - - -BEGIN NEW text in Post: One other term, FD3>FD4, in a middle area, did. The problem seems NOT to do with characters limit (though these are big 2200 ch. forumlas). - - - more info- providing formula: I'd prefer not to make public my entire BUY Signals, even if dependent on many studies, etc.. (I could send privately most of it & provide detail of other column reference that did it. Adding L3=0 anywhere in the top 2 lines, it quits. I'll try it elsewhere. My settings are for intrabar signals in short time frame, so I often have negating exits concurrently or just prior. (I do not yet lock state-- had trouble doing that). Here are the beginning few lines. =AND(K4=0,(P3-P6)<320,OR(GI3>(GK3+.8), GO3>(GO4+.2),GK3>GO3), GC3>-520,NOT(AND(GK3>(GK4- .4),GK3> -6,GE3<(GC3+11),GE3<160,GC3<160,(OR(P3<230,AND(P3>229,P3>P4,V3>190))),(E3- E20)<3.5,(E3-E12)<2 )), ... etc. I'm thinking circular dependencies. I've run prior and after compares to make sure those are the only terms changed (using WORD Review>> Compare. I keep audit steps in NOTEPAD of each rev., & have frequent full Backups. This is not a "finger bounce" error. I'll work on this off and on for the next day to see if any new clues show up, before you spend time on it. |
| [2016-04-06 18:04:44] |
| User791263 - Posts: 151 |
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RE: Jeffrey's Post 4. Test Completed: Opened spreadsheet alone. Added L3=0 term. No affect Opened matching Chartbook Opening process worked until near complete (43charts/avg 10 studies per- takes 1 minute) All charts appeared,file opening (downloading) began When data accessed & computations began -- boom. Quit |
| [2016-04-06 18:05:46] |
| Jeffrey - Posts: 2287 |
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I'd prefer not to make public my entire BUY Signals, even if dependent on many studies, etc..
(I could send privately most of it & provide detail of other column reference that did it. You can attach files and make them private. See this page for instructions: Attaching a File (Optional). |
| [2016-04-06 19:11:42] |
| User791263 - Posts: 151 |
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In Response Post #7, re private attachmt Attached are all 38 Lines in K. (including OR Line with nothing else on line) NOTES are in top of same text file, above K Lines include line feeds (a AND logic line may span 3 lines) The other term than L3=0 that blew it up was FD3>FD4, FD = overlayed study, Moving Average of 1-sec chart's study Was tried as 2nd term in line #12 The spreadsheet is extensive, refernced by a same-layout spreadsheet, time frame,duplicated from a 3-Line Chart format (makes it like longer-timer frame). This all normally works-runs fine, has been near this way for over a month, with recently-added maybe 8 lines to formula in last 2 weeks. Reliabaly Ran, and runs live & backtest, except for this small added term. Nothing major, structural or layout has been changed. The only difference is larger formulas & slight more cross-reference to 3-Line chart sheet (31). |
Private File Attachment Deleted. |
| [2016-04-06 20:01:32] |
| User791263 - Posts: 151 |
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I tested for condition L3=0 via H3, indirectly, then put H3=0 into K formula, in place where L3=0 was tried. Same result. Instance quits. Seems something about current line reference, possibly which deals with J- Column? Perhaps refering crossways on Row 3 of J-col-monitored-stored values/conditions was forbidden in your code. But the FD3>FD4, term did not deal with J col. |
| [2016-04-06 20:53:48] |
| User791263 - Posts: 151 |
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My L Exit had no problem when I added K3=0 to it. I took out 3 lines of formula from K to be sure Size of formula was not the issue. Still quit on add of L3=0 to first line. I tried indirect L3=0 via the only other (duplicate 3-Line chart) sheet 31, putting Sheet37!L3 in its L-col (like the H3 attempt) (this sheet normally has no signals K L M N (no other autotrade) Then referencing Sheet31!L3 from original problem #37 K-col Same failure as using H3 "indirect" That is, both behave exactly like putting L3=0 into K formula. My intrabar AutoTrade settings may invoke your(?) possible internal prohibitions on K testing L before end-of-bar with those settings only? This may happen on M too, testing for N3=0. I need to double check that. SETTINGS on this AutoTrade Ch37: Reset on new bar Yes Allow multiple entries Yes Signal once per bar No Cancel all orders on entry No Allow entry with workin order Yes Signal on Bar close No Support Reversals Yes Allow opposite Entrywith Opp Position Yes |
| [2016-04-06 21:10:08] |
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We will take care of this problem. We do not need any further details unless we ask. The issue is not what you think it is. The problem is either running out of stack space or a stack corruption. It is a problem in the spreadsheets we need to solve. Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, *change* to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing |
| [2016-04-06 21:13:36] |
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Actually we need to get the entire Spreadsheet file you are using and the simple steps to reproduce the problem. The file has a SCSS file extension. We cannot do any testing without that. Here are the instructions to attach it: Support Board Posting Information: Attaching a File (Optional) So if you do not want to share that, we have to close this support request. Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, *change* to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing |
| [2016-04-06 21:43:28] |
| Jeffrey - Posts: 2287 |
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I tested the full formula for K given in the attachment in post #8 on an otherwise blank spreadsheet, including the mentioned changes, but did not encounter any issues. This issue is likely specific to a particular condition that is dependent on the other formulas and data in the spreadsheet, so I believe we will need the full spreadsheet to diagnose the problem.
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| [2016-04-06 21:52:31] |
| Jeffrey - Posts: 2287 |
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RE: Jeffrey's Post 4.
If you could try this again, after adding the L3=0 term, select the full range for the column you just modified (K3:K1002, for example), and select Spreadsheet >> Copy Down from the menu. If that causes the program to quit, save the spreadsheet just before selecting that menu item, and upload it as a private file.
Test Completed: Opened spreadsheet alone. Added L3=0 term. No affect Opened matching Chartbook Opening process worked until near complete (43charts/avg 10 studies per- takes 1 minute) All charts appeared,file opening (downloading) began When data accessed & computations began -- boom. Quit |
| [2016-04-06 21:59:35] |
| User791263 - Posts: 151 |
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Jeffrey's test in a blank spreadsheet confirms that the issue is likely not inherent to the K formula. SC Eng has said, and I appreciate that you can't get deep into complex autotrade systems. Would the one .scss file help (?) since this all flows through from 30 prior charts and 5 prior spreadsheets, lots of overlays onto this #37, with two main charts-sheets, 31 & 37 working together (31 being the origin of duplicate 37,but 31 being 3-Line bard Study filter. If you think the .scss will help, I will. Or you could ponder it, look at it on the back-burner, and suggest stress tests for me to give you results. Thanks so much for your prompt, interested response. This L3=0 is something helpful for intrabar trades, & might be for end-of-bar trades. |
| [2016-04-06 22:07:20] |
| Jeffrey - Posts: 2287 |
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The .scss file is necessary for diagnosing this issue, because it appears that it likely has to do with the interactions of multiple formulas on the sheet, as well as possibly the specific data in the sheet at the time.
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| [2016-04-07 03:31:53] |
| User791263 - Posts: 151 |
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Does the .scss file contain data too? of the last X-number Records in Settings? As said, data comes from wide sources in layers before those two, #31,#37. It's not just two or three charts and studies upon their symbols. ie: you can't recreate similar data. (I followed your notes to not include from an overlay of a spreadsheet.) We trust SC and staff more than any other company. However, for business secrets to legally be screts, a person or company must always seek confidentiality/ non-disclosure, like SC does. Can you agree to that (generally like your terms for SC subscription), plus to not use it or a near-derivative, and to erase all copies after debugging? (I know SC would never risk their reputation,but I am required to ask.) Just a general statement like the above. Answer privately if you prefer. Would screenshots of the spreadsheet or a video of it running, showing sections-- be helpful if you had the .scss ? Date Time Of Last Edit: 2016-04-07 13:25:51
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| [2016-04-07 18:09:31] |
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Does the .scss file contain data too?
Yes it does.Can you agree to that (generally like your terms for SC subscription),
Yes, we agree to do this.plus to not use it or a near-derivative, and to erase all copies after debugging? We just need the spreadsheet file and we will see the problem under the debugger. Would screenshots of the spreadsheet or a video of it running, showing sections-- be helpful if you had the .scss ? We do not need this. It is not relevant for what we need to test. Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, *change* to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing Date Time Of Last Edit: 2016-04-07 18:10:06
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| [2016-04-07 23:21:43] |
| TechTrader - Posts: 116 |
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This has happened to me when the spreadsheet formula had a circular reference.
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| [2016-04-08 04:55:49] |
| User791263 - Posts: 151 |
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RE: Jeffrey Post# 14. I never get that far, or I don't understand. The formula with added L3=0 never gets into the top of the column. It all vanishes when I try to put it in and hit OK. I'm sending the .scss file. I keep daily full backups, so I went back to early Tuesday, made a copy of it, tried to shorten the Buy formula and a couple others (taking out some AND Lines), to see if that made any difference. It did not-- still quit. Since that is the simplest, earliest form of this when this happened, and the smallest I've tried and still get the problem--- I'll just send that shortened one; Might help simplify your debugging. (It did not matter Vers 1382 or 1392 (which I updated Monday(?). I tested both--same problem) This should quit like a charm when you add L3=0 to K3 formula. Thank you and good luck. This is no big hurry. I've got plenty to do for a week or more before needing it. NOTE Post #19. I'll attach to the next post. |
| [2016-04-08 05:06:51] |
| User791263 - Posts: 151 |
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Here's the subject .scss , for L3=0 in K3 problem under our confidentiality agreement. |
Private File |
| [2016-04-08 05:22:23] |
| User791263 - Posts: 151 |
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The AutoTrade is Sheet #37. Sheet37 was duplicated from the 3-Line Break study original same-time-frame chart filter #31, , which acts like a longer-timeframe, variable length bars. Sheet #37 columns may look strange, due to removing and reinstalling studies & overlay of autotrade spreadsheet into #37. I don't think that's our problem, because-- as odd as it looks, it works adequately and I know what those columns all are/where they come from. Values in DK, DM, GI, GK, GO columns may not appear correctly until the system runs awhile, so that the multiply subgraph fills out the Ch#37 (faster) rows before the 3-Line break has gone to a new bar. When SC stops, those values may not appear correct. |
| [2016-04-08 05:32:13] |
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Also, we are very busy and it is not necessary to post all of the information you are. All we need to know is that Sierra Chart is abnormally shutting down without any error message, you are working with a Spreadsheet that you have put together, and you have entered a certain formula when it happens. We need just one or two sentences and the spreadsheet file. This is all. The rest of the information given here is completely unnecessary for us. If there is anything more we need we will ask. Sierra Chart Support - Engineering Level Your definitive source for support. Other responses are from users. Try to keep your questions brief and to the point. Be aware of support policy: https://www.sierrachart.com/index.php?l=PostingInformation.php#GeneralInformation For the most reliable, advanced, and zero cost futures order routing, *change* to the Teton service: Sierra Chart Teton Futures Order Routing |
| [2016-04-11 20:12:08] |
| Jeffrey - Posts: 2287 |
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The issue with Sierra Chart quitting under these particular conditions should be fixed in the next release.
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